Thanks Frances

I have not been a decent guy to myself for awhile. I had a life before all this and for the most part I enjoyed my own company. There are days, and there are days…..Depending on what voices my wife is hearing that day, she can be engaging and somewhat fun to be around. the next minute or day she can be distant to the point where there is no possible way to notice otherwise. My sanity is often to just not engage. It’s empowering, but so darn lonely being married to an adversary. Example. She asks me a question on any topic. Frustrations, fears….you name it. She asks, I answer the best I can. She is often never inhibited or constrained to any topic, but i am (and she has said) at least I’m for the most part truthful.
If i ask a question she typically asks me the same question, ignores me, or brings up instances out of context where I may have said or done the same thing. A lot of times she leaves out the outcome of these past situations, ignoring the fact that she confronts me with the issues and I engage in answers. Frankly, not responding whatsoever is the worst followed by being asked the same question.
I spoke my story line with a professional awhile ago, and her comment was if i were angry at the outcome I really had every reason in the world to be.

Lets face it. My wife alone choose to stay home and not work. At the time the excuse i heard was “You will not share duties bringing up the kids and it will all fall back to me.” Well, I never promised anyone a rose garden. So, she basically told me that it would just be too hard.
Why not try it for awhile and then show me how it would have never worked out? She never ever gave it serious thought.

Thanks for your support!

Glad to read comments from the real world from a real woman with real self esteem. I work with woman all day long who are in the work force because they really have to be. Be it benefits to bridge their husbands self employed status, make ends meet, pay for college, save for retirement with employer 401K match, or just to keep fresh and out of the house. You know….stuff adults do.
In an amusing way your posts ticks me off because it reminds me of how screwed up my life has become.

A professional recently posed the following question. “I you were to wake up tomorrow in your perfect world, what would that look like?” I took the bait and ran with it without hesitation.
I wouldn’t worry most of the time that the stress of my job (which I hate but am financially trapped in) didn’t contribute to my epilepsy, I could spend more time with my kids and have a better relationship with them, I could transition into another career, felt I have a partner who gives a crap how I feel and deal with all of this….Notice that all these needs not being met are not material?

Thanks for the reality check..

Thread On Domestic Violence

tomg says

November 5, 2011 at 1:14 pm

Thanks
As I said this is not the first time. When I bring up the previous times her reaction reminds me of a child that blames everyone else for their behavior. In these cases she is empowered through the insular Oprah world view of sexist generalizations and ignor any adult basis for reason and responsibility of their actions via DNA.
Being told I was being a “big baby” only flows one way. There are no visuals of a woman in a tee shirt drinking beer raising a hand to her husband and then blaming him for making her angry. Lets face it. If a man sports a black eye or a slinged arm the vast majority of people automatically assume he probably had it coming. If a woman presented with the same injuries that vast majority would push the sympathy button and pin the “pre-judgement O Meter.”
Truthfully, I do blame myself. I do have strong urges to apologise and calm the raging waters so it will never happen again. This man does not like to see my wife upset, and oddly I still fret that her pep talks with her therapist (who is not only divorced but who’s husband cheated on her) is mixing this bonding agent to keep this delusional story line intact.
I think it is just healthier for us to get away from one another. There are things in our relationship and in society that won’t permit me any benefit of the doubt. So why risk the exposure? Everyone, and I mean everyone says I should move on.

Log in to Reply

• shrink4men says

  November 5, 2011 at 2:54 pm

  Go to the police station and file a report, tomg. Today.

  Log in to Reply
  • tomg says

    February 23, 2012 at 8:17 pm

    I missed my opportunity. It’s been months now. I see my attorney monday to discuss options. I might get hosed with tuition into infinity + lifetime alimony.
    I have a passport and can arrange to take care of everyone’s NEEDS. If she WANTS more, she can work or try and find me.
    I’m done

Well…It happened again a week ago. Me and the Mrs. were arguing and I threw a baseball cap against the wall. I’ve NEVER laid a hand on her, but I have been assaulted by her a few times. once in front of her family.
With that outburst, she dove over the bed, grabbed my face, hit me up the side of my head and then kneed me in the balls. She would have still been pounding me still if i hadn’t pushed her away and threatened to call the police.
She then claimed that I had manufactured the whole episode to get her arrested. I withdrew.
More shock….she then called her therapist for what i can only guess was a major add on to her story line.
She then upped her last claim that 15 of the 20 year marriage was bad, to “It was bad from day one.” Hummmmmm. IS anyone out there crying for her yet?
The poor dear putting up with never working a day and all the rest of it…..I guess I can be called the abusive partner for throwing a hat against a wall and defending myself. What would Oprah say????Oh dear. Can Dr. Oz spare an ice pack for my family jewels?

I’m done folks! Who gives a shit…

Yep. A lot of talk and threats in the past. Now she does not even look at me or seem to want to stay in the same room. I protect myself by exiting the room first, or read a book if in bed.
If there is a wedding, I am the first and last person on the dance floor. I’m not a good dancer I assure you, it’s something like breathing and participating in the event rather be anywhere near exposed to their trigger fingers.
Frankly, I notice it pisses her off that I talk, laugh and interact with people who she knows aren’t red hot on her or her family. Truth is, I smile my ass off and laugh at other people’s jokes. It’s a hoot! Most times I actually forget about my anxiety walking into these parties.
Then when we hook up after a dance near our table, and, in the style of my master, my face sort of changes and I speak very monotone one or two word answers as I take the dance floor with gusto. An object in motion tends to stay in motion.
A former girlfriend of mine (35 years ago who is married and Mother to two young men) heard about my epilepsy (her oldest boy is having his third brain surgery in a month for his seizures) gave me (her son did) a metal of the patron Saint of neurological disorders. I wore it and she went into her best passive aggressive personality rage ever. Rage meaning a silent sneak attack. A beating that leaves no physical scars or marks. It was like a science project.
We have sex once a month (if that) barely talk, and by all appearances don’t seem to like one another – so what’s the downside?
I’ll keep hanging around all the other black sheep. Maybe we can start a club. The stories I hear from these sheep sometimes cheer me up. I’m thinking it might be more DNA than behavior, bad toilet training, or Daddy issues.

If you can, latch onto and richly savor these few shallow and meaningless opportunities to be obnoxious. Make a game out of it.

What the fuck….

Oh, seperating the accounts is good for your soul for a few weeks. Trust me, unless you are made of tempered steel, it won’t help. We can’t win peace unless we remove ourselves which requires certain and painful consequences.
You seem like a very sensitive caring guy. Some men can take a life of malicious unfulfilled needs. BTW: All the social workers say the same thing “take care of yourself.” If it were only that easy playing squash, taking up fishing, or watching NASCAR. Face it, we want a deep intimate relationship with somebody who meets your needs as well. Somebody we can do these things with, not take up to escape pain.
If it’s not clear to our wives yet, they have a plan of their own and it does not include us. “Hurrah for me and the hell with you.”

Just Some Guy
I feel your pain. After the shit hit the fan with my son, we hired an educational consultant to deal with what was then a crisis. Our son was totally out of control and all my wife could come back to was a very expensive wilderness program (6 – 8 weeks in the woods) followed by a year in a therapeutic boarding school. The consultants don’t like to give you any real financial footings, but from people I know going through it, or have been down this path, a very optimistic cost would be in excess of $150,000. Best outside estimate would be $175,000 +.
The whole situation, so I am told, is “a process.” Code for bend over and get out your checkbook.
I begged my wife for some help. She has bonds she refuses to cash in, and a resume that is over 10 years old. Being cornered I verbally let loose and demanded to know if she would tap into her vast untapped earning potential as a science teacher. Her answer???? Get ready………”I’ll get a job at a supermarket.” I let it fly calling her delusional and abusive. Out of touch, mean, and probably setting me up. Folks, between both children’s private school, the monthly nut is north of $14,000/ month. A MONTH!
She went on to say: “I don’t think you (me) should look at spending this money as a handout to our son. He needs help.” “Besides, you (me) don’t have to pay it all at once.” Well, it’s officially my MY problem!
I put my foot down, set up counseling for the entire family (a bleeding joke) and have a few contingency plans if he starts acting out again. Thankfully he’s currently on track, but who really knows. I guess that is a “process” as well.
One option I floated was simply tossing him out. Destroy property, coming in after 3 drunk and high, verbally abusing people. Police, etc is reason enough for me. You can’t force someone to change or accept therapy as a captive in the wilderness of Utah.
If anybody finds themselves in this position (I hope the hell not) keep asking the so called professionals a question: “And then what?” The big “And then what” was my belief after all that “process” he could not come home where got in trouble to begin with. My wife was mute….meaning she (not me) would not close that door.
My response: “You have no vote.”
Oh….her therapist must be working overtime to deconstruct what I said.
I am frigging in the wilderness, be have started seeing a very good social worker myself. I’m drinking from a fire hose with information to calm my mind and settle, but this is tough.

Here is the hook. For awhile I was going for the hook. I really felt (as I have since we started having kids) that if I give her something she really wanted it would please her and we would be closer. NOT THEN. NOT NOW. NOT EVER! Same woman who forged my name to tuition documents over my strong objections to send him to a Waldorf School…which is a cult. Pretty big in Calf.

I’ll therefore add one more pleading in addition to begging, reasoning etc…..Giving in.
So now our marraige is on auto pilot. She stays busy with animal rescue, and when that “job” gets a little too busy, she steps back and drops more responsibility on my head. The message is clear: “FU!” Yet, in public she is loved and gives love. We just ignore one another and she acts like a total bitch bastard when I do not let her provoke me into jumping up and down.

Guy, I understand perfectly. A study I read recently followed many couples who were having significant marriage problems. The result was of the couples who divorced almost none saw a significant improvement in their lives. The ones who struggled through were happier in five years. The primary reason was that they just got tired of fighting. Simply gave up on things they could not change. Encouraging huh? Get beaten to a pulp and like a POW become attracted to your captors. Learn to love being unhappy. Talk about the final death of an intimate relationship.

My wife has said to me that the problems I have now (my problems) will just follow me into my next relationship. Forget about meeting each other’s needs, just get used to ignoring them and they will go away. The mind F’ing is limitless.

If i could walk out my door right now with little or no consequences, there would be a sonic boom.

Rob

This one’s easy. You will be trading charge cards with alimony. AND alimony is a huge tax deduction for you. You might come out ahead on so many levels.
Also, if a man controls a woman it’s abuse. If a woman controls a man, it’s a bad relationship.
We are always wrong and the courts see these woman the same way.
If those were the numbers I was looking at, I’d be oughta there in a second. I’d leave the news on a Post It note on the fridg. , serve the papers and move on.

Hi All
I need an editor. This article is about parenting styles. It’s pretty obvious what they are saying is that opposite parenting styles are not a bad thing altogether. HOWEVER, in the article is talks about the Husband (the layed back parent) and the children being afraid of the wife/mother.
I’m trying to wrap my head around the obvious role reversal where the Wife and Children confess they are afraid of the Dad/Husband.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/peggy-drexler/when-parents-have-differe_b_1925090.html?utm_hp_ref=daily-brief?utm_source=DailyBrief&utm_campaign=100112&utm_medium=email&utm_content=BlogEntry&utm_term=Daily%20Brief

Unresolved childhood issues? OMG! My wife’s Dad died when she was 4-5. I am 7 years older, have a great job, stable and from what I can feel, a poor replacement for her need of a strong Daddy figure in her life.
She tells me the relationship was “bad day one.” She was probably more right than wrong. I did what i could do as a human being, and because she chose wrong, I am suffering as a result of my efforts. or course it was bad day one. it was delusion on her part as opposed to illusion which is generally seen by many.
i am screwed. I love a woman who wanted to be taken care of, and because I did not live up to her childhood delusion am suffering as a result. It’s a lost cause.

Believe it or not, about a year ago I gave my wife top billing (no pun) on our printed checks and our joint checking account as evidence that I consider our relationship equal. She says she’s always been hurt and slighted by the fact that I “control all the money” and this was my shallow gesture to prove her wrong. She wanted balance and equality and I handed it over with the dignity of a violin player on the Titanic. I credit the account, and she debit’s it. Her part is to keep that cash flowing down hill and unrestrained. Call it her part in contributing to the her own economic recovery. Writing the checks and making sure the bills are paid on time = her part. Pish posh on that old fashioned automatic bill pay! Y3K looms and we are well ahead of that curve.
Dr. Phil is mailing me that merit badge as I type………………..Collect!
It was all my guilt from years of listening to all the horror stories of grueling puppet shows, snooty Moms at play dates, fending off the apocalypse boredom, or cracking the code of “what’s for dinner?” God Bless older divorced female Certified Marriage Therapists. Without them I would have never seen the error of my ways or come in touch with my lack of empathy. As a result I have created a financial model that rivals Enron and would send Madof scrambling for a pencil. Changing nouns is indeed the spotlight. Nobody would put up with that for 10 seconds, and my wife’s family (females) would descend on me like the entire studio audience of the Vue and Oprah combined with Dr. Oz in attendance to administer the lethal injection. BTW: Are there any such men’s shows out there like this web site. Maybe it’s time. It’s expected that when men come together to talk about this stuff they lower their heads, speak softly out of the corners of their mouths, and almost take some strange level of pride in who is the most unhappy. It’s like we don’t mean it or want to admit that we are really pretty fed up, depressed, alone or hopeless. It’s like a game of misery horseshoes.

If anything Gents, this site has given me a sense of community. A healthy perspective on what’s been nagging me or lacking in my understanding of what happened. Unless I married a total shrew, I don’t think she is really doing this as a conscious effort to see if I could bite my left ear, or financially ruin our family. It is just wrong minded thinking on her part and something better sought after by a trained professional. I can see it very clear now and am better equiped to cope with reality. As sad and hopeless as it may seem.

No reason need apply!

Vince
My Wife and I never discussed if it made sense or not. She took her highest honors science teaching degree and decided to stay home and wipe noses and asses. Fast forward…..our boys are 17 and 15 and have managed their own hygiene for many years.
Both are in private schools now (our oldest is waiting to get into military school because he simply failed his Jr. year of high school, is smoking ample amounts of pot and drinking – plus girls girls girls). Yep, all that stay home Mom stuff is paying off in spades…..The most hurtful part echoed by her family is that I worked too much and was “not present” in his life. Shame on me for not quitting my job and staying home.
The literal kicker is that she and her family also lampoon my Wife’s Sister’s Husband for not working enough so they (meaning her Sister) can work less, take better vacations, and save for both college and retirement (I KID YOU NOT). All the stuff I’ve been doing for over 20 years ALONE. These are the same people who tell me that I worry too much about money and that if I just stop fretting I’ll realize (again, I shit you not) “That the money always seems to come.”
They are 100% right though, and I also know why. So nobody else has to worry about it. They also talk about trying to give them $10 or $20K to catch their breath…..Moral hazard anyone? Magic thinking at it’s finest brought to you by self entitled, unempathetic, selfish, self absorbed dunderheads. What do I do lately? I just stand still and keep the ink in my pen.
My problem was that I explained and defended myself every step of the way becasue I cared a whole lot about everyone. I’m not a tyrant, I just don’t rush into anything anymore or pay attention to the attendant silent treatment and stonewalling.

Good Luck

You sound like good people and good parents. You have gone above and beyond. Tough love, but empathetic. A hard balancing act. Our son is 17, ADHD to the max. Smoking and dealing pot, drinking, and having a lot of sex with younger girls (thank God with protection – that we know of).
A friend of mine who went through this told me: You did not create it, you can’t control it and you can’t cure it. Sounds easy, right?
We are going through everything at this point. Blaming one another, her family blaming me for not being able to raise the boys better AND work a job that takes care of everything while their daughter cried working and child care were just too hard. Never attempted it, but I guess it just sounded like too much work. Who knows?

We looked into wilderness programs, therapeutic boarding schools to the tune of over $150,000/ year. NOT. My wife “wants” that though TADA!
I found a very good military boarding school about an hour from home, and our son seems very eager to go. Thank God.

Fact is I learned in business that you have to place, manage and execute by the rule. Focus on the goal and forget (for the most part) the hundreds of scenarios that could work or go terribly wrong. If you look at things as one big unending problem you are essentially letting problems manage you. Solving a problem with a problem.

I say military school because the problem is behavioral and not all together smoking pot, although selling the stuff is criminal. yes, he can buy and sell the stuff at school. He can just hook up with his friends on weekends and holidays and pick up where he left off, but my goal at this point is to give him a golden opportunity to graduate high school. That’s it. I can’t guaranty happiness or a magical turnaround if he spends 6 weeks in the woods making fires without matches, nor can I fathom what would happen after 8-12 months forced education and “therapy.” I don’t believe that worked out well at the Hanoi Hilton. It is brainwashing, and part of the program is they come and get them in the middle of the night. Oh yeah, this is serious and Utah is a very parent friendly state to get away with this type “program.”

There are no studies or peer reviews on the outcome of these programs, so anyone reading and in this fix, speak to as many people as possible first. Going to therapy and making someone go (with our without a court order) is somewhat of a joke.
Just keep asking the question: “And then what?” Wilderness program turns into boarding school. Boarding school turns into a step down halfway house, etc etc….bottom line, with this economy and a high school GED, the kid will end up back at home where the trouble started. In other words, it’s a waste of time.

Anyway, if you can take it and convince your wife, take the hard line. “We love you, hate what you are doing to yourself, but we wish you well. Be prepared to get a restraining order and late night calls crying that they are sleeping in somebody's tool shed. (A few friends of mine who are all very born again Christians, took such measures to protect themselves and the other children in the home.

Just me talking, but it might do you well to speak to somebody for awhile if your wife is not on the same page. Often both of you are scared shitless or are so confused and, in my case, angry as hell.

Your not alone.

Watch two or three kids? Get onboard the Rationalization Express. Then when my wife took in two, she behavied as if it were something that kept our family going since I was portrayed as CHEAP. You got it! A cheapskate depriving her and the children….HOWEVER, all that money she made went into HER bank account. Ah yes!
I also love this woman with all my heart, but she makes my hair hurt trying to reason with crazy.
If your like me you will defer to her needs and wants and hope it makes her happy. IT WON’T.
I let her go what she wanted, and in the end I was accused of being emotionally not present for my children. I still haven’tfully removed that knife from my back.
My wife’s Dad died when she was 5 so she’s well grounded in her own imagination of what would have been. Most of us grew up with Dad’s who had a few warts, in her case her Dad was Ward Clever and Superman. Add to that her Mom had an abusive and absent Dad, and her Grandmother the same. This is a Social Worker’s dream. Take all that and add that my wife’s spiritual mentor is her lesbian Aunt who was supposidly raped as a young girl and blames everything on “the stars” and not herself.
I should have made a clean gettaway when I could.

On a bright note, I found a very nice house recently and know that financially I can carry all of it + the house I’m in. It would be like being divorced without lawyers and retainers. I have not tipped my hand yet, but did ask her to look at it. I had my realtor call her who is a freind of ours) and she asked a few questions, but expressed no interest in looking at it. One of the purposes would be to get my boys in a decent school system. We tried to move 10 years ago to that district, but again i was overruled.

Your not alone Jason

Log in to Reply

Just a question. Through all the piled up cloths, dirty dishes, yardwork (maybe some inconsistant dinners?) did you cram your pride down deep and restrain yourself from being a sterotypical nag?
If so you can also relate to the same balancing act I played for years. Every day was a “lets just do whatever happens today” structure for her while I did what I was elected to do, make a living.
So many nights coming home to tails about a tough day at the puppet show and how the terrible 2’s got its name terrible I actually wondered what I was doing wrong or could do better. I get it. Wiping noses and asses all day is very hard work that typically does not start at 8 and end at 5 and have many if at all weekends off even if your under the weather. I have all the empathy in the world for what that’s like to endure, but when basics are not covered, clothes piled up, dishes etc. one has to question priorities.
In my case the more I took on the more time she had to watch her sister’s children. Yeah, you read it correctly. I took on the chores at home so she could take on chores at someone elses house…………..You may recall that when I was allowed to bring this up in marriage counseling she actually reached out and grabbed my leg and shook it yelling for me to shut up….The therapist was stunned, but to her discredit never explored that outburst. I suppose it was condoned?
She has also never worked outside of the home or otherwise make use of her teaching degree, rather she plunged herself into animal rescue and taunted me that I should also find a hobby. I thought a hobby was something you did to relax AFTER YOU WORKED? For the record, I work and really have no outlet. See, it’s even!
One more note concerning the Mayor of crazyland. She recently mowed two of our neighbors lawns while they were away and asked a third neighbor if she wanted her to maintain their property while they tried to sell their house. Yes, $25/ cut…….+ extras. To complete the picture, my property currently looks like South Viet Nam. I cut it last weekend…. I kid you not.
Anyway, my question was concerning repressed feelings.

Good luck

Hi
This issue I feel I’ve been dealing with early on in a 20 year marraige is a passive agressive personality. She has never been able to confront or participate in real issues. I don’t think she really knows its happening. She is terribly forgetful with me and may of her freinds. Deafening silent on real issues that require some uncomfortable discussion. She listens, but literally contributes little. I has driven my crazy for years. Early on I would express my opinion on issues that somewhat made us appear less than the always happy couple. She shut down, ignored it, would not discuss it then or ever again. naturally the issues surfaced again and i got the same non response…Only this time i would get angry. My anger shut her down more. on and on and on.
Everyone loves her (me also) because she answers their questions, engages in conversation, etc while I felt put aside, isolated and depressed. I find myself apologizing for stuff I did that only seemed to be in my head. Who wouldn’t?
Then I was cast further aside as being too sensitive or thin skinned. In other words, don’t expect me discuss issues because the more I give non answers the more you (me) seem to want to pursue them. I could deal with a big fat F you rather than NOTHING. Actually NOTHING is a big fat F you once or twice removed from reality.
Sooooo, I’m painted as the overy sensitive pest…The truly sad part is the dynamic works perfectly. I get so PO I have even dropped the D word which again empowers her that I am not worthy of serious discussion. i.e. The bad guy.
i have even tried my own stonewalling. Fighting stonewall with stonewall… People, it’s horrible because the goal is complete and total noncommunication. Suits her fine, but drives a stake through my heart and I get bitter and angrier.
Marriage counseling? She does not truthfully participate. The counselor we did go to at one point asked her if she was afraid of me. Afraid of me? I had never thought that way before, but it occured to me later on that truthfully sharing in a stand and deliver situation was nearly hopeless.
She went to counseling alone and shortly after she went I noticed she became somewhat more assertive, but in a very negative way toward me. Victim? Oh yeah!
Question + no answer = frustration. Frustration + no answer = self doubt Self doubt + no answer = anger Anger + no answer = hopelessness Hopelessness + no answer = depression Depression + no answer = detachment “Detachment?” See, she was right! I really don’t care…..I knew it ! I really didn’t deserve and answer at all.
It all equals insanity.

I feel your pain. My son came home last night at 2:30 drunk on vodka. I knew he was on something else and I said so. He dared me to test him. So this morning I bought a home drug test and …ta da! I took him up on his offer. Both pot and amphetamines….Good job.
We also got notification today he’s repeating his Jr. year in high school. Just a whole bowl of wrong!
He seems to be moving up in the world. I make light of this but if I didn’t I’d go mad.
Again the opening cost of a comprehensive program is north of $150,000. I diplomatically made an inquiry about liquidating her bonds to pay for part of this. Took seconds to hit the stone wall. She is consistent…

My strategy going forward? STAND STILL. My son is out of control, but MY feeling all along has been let him find his bottom. All the “therapy” in the world won’t help unless his heart is open to it. It’s not. $150K would therefore pay for hypnotizing a chicken.
The wife also had these issues when she was young, so the pendulum swings. The pathology is obvious.
All families have issues, and most if not all people are out of their frigging minds. The question is, too what degree?
Like you my wife is a very frugal person. She balances that out with cat rescue. Not the worst thing in the world, unless it rises to the level of a cult.

Should I stay? I say no for the same reasons you outline. I’m just not ready to destroy the village in order to save it. Yet.

Talking to people does help to a point. We can blame everyone all day long, but as in therapy the focus is really on us and what we want. Controlling our emotions is a big one for me. It makes no sense. Focus on myself is not easy when you have no idea where your mate is coming from. Maybe she’s waiting also? What do they say? Its complicated.

Stand still for now. See what happens, but remember. Your not crazy or alone.

I think she will be glad to see me go. Being, dependent, resentful, entitled and the identified victim will leave no doubt her justification for being paid the rest of my life.

I am far from perfect, but my resentment is almost entirely centered on not having an equal partner. (I’ve said this to her as plain as you are reading this). She quietly pouted how I was so controlling of our finances, yet she kept “her” money well segregated and balanced while I juggled supporting three people.

In a very real way I also felt embarrassed that we/I was struggling so hard to give her what she seemed to want. My biggest enemy were all the second guessing and doubt. I was told I thought and worried too much…..somebody had to.

When I started to wake up some time ago I did remind her that she should really be grateful I did all this so she didn’t have to. The response I get lately is “It’s not all about you.”

Well, it is about me because I’m a big part of our family. Her Dad died when she was 4, I’m 7 years older….I get it. But see, I’m not her abstract notion of a husband or father. She romanticized and embellished (all natural) her dad which nobody could live up to in the real world. It’s a shit sandwich.
My hard work and her stonewalling are a very bad combination. The more she sits still and less she says , the more second guessing I undertake, angrier I get, and the resentment builds. I feel like a marble in a tin can.

Most men are task oriented to some great degree. When the task is clear and your partner says NOTHING most anybody would naturally assume something was wrong.
So, rather than keep walking in the dark waiting for your nose to find the sharp edge of a door, I stopped altogether. Then the terms “emotionally absent” a la Oprah and Dr. Phil started popping up.
Talk about not knowing if you are foot or horseback….

It became easier and easier to throw up my hands and walk to my corner. I blocked out part of the silence by working which even though I disliked it, gave me some degree of satisfaction and control. Control of my thoughts, not of another person. I did not sign on to this. I wanted and was led to believe my wife would be appreciative and my equal.

I so want this to work and have some clarity as to the pathology that got us here in the first place, that some type of counseling will without question be in order to either bring this to a head, our set the new world order. It gives me more options in the near term.

Anyway, thanks for reading all my blather. Your comments and support help.

Regards

Hi
I can list a few times (two) when my wife either physically struck me or loomed in a way that suggested she was about to or wanted to. She is by far a very quiet person and very much a forgiving and helpful person. Everyone likes her.
The problem is she witholds emotions.
I often tell people who I work with who feel put upon by a boss that if this boss were treating you different than anyone else, then your fears probably have some validity. In my case my wife is freindly, helpful, and enthusiastic around others including our children, but I often see her feelings for others stop on a dime when she is in the uncomfortible presence of me. I often feel (today for example) of what I can do to make this relationship better. Is it something I say/said? Is it my approach? Maybe I can’t make her comfortible enough to share with me?
I discuss these things with her and am treated with a resounding stare, or the ignomity of her asking me the same things I asked her + the newly acquired Shink Talk of “What does that look like to you”? I want to pull my own teeth out thinking of how I’m portrayed in and out of therapy.
I’m at this very moment feeling shame that I am not mature enough to deal with my wifes therapy (maybe it will help, but I doubt it).
I’m all over the place.

Again, I can’t explain it. It’s been going on for years. Her silence does anger me and that anger then seems to do a few things. It neatly and cleanly transfers the issue into my anger management “issues.” It seems to support her persona of the good person, and assigns blame for the very issue we disagree on me. I consider myself a very sensitive person, so this discord makes me feel very guilty and out of sorts for a long time.
I guess to keep the persona of “the good partner” you need a really big SOB to prove it. Yeah, I’ve heard it all. Mood issues. Anger issues. Being unavailible. Not being an attentive father. Guys, it hurts. it really hurts.
Then my wife sees her therapist and she seems to have developed a more self rightious way of dealing with me. I don’t know whether I’m on foot or horseback alot of the time. Then I expess my feelings and an told “It’s all about you”, or ‘It’s not all about you.” Is she right? Am I missing something? How do I cope with or reason with this? Oh, and I can’t leave out her claim that I am too dramatic. I do feel literally emotionally cut off at the pass.

Hi All

The problem in a nutshell (no pun intended) is I don’t want to break up my family. I love my Wife and at times actually feel sorry for her that she is not capable of expressing herself. I long ago gave up the notion she wouldn’t share with me. She just can’t and that must be a very lonely place to be.
I am just stuck on how I can help bring about change. I have detached over the years, but later accused of “not being present.” I even consulted with an attorney when I was very convinced there was zero hope, but relented for marraige counseling instead. The result was my Wife beat me to the punch and started seeing our former marriage counselor alone w/o even discussing it, before, during or after she went. This is her MO. No discussion, no problem. Stand in a room with your eyes shut and nobody can see her.
Now our son is going through some heavy duty emotional stuff, drugs, sex, booze and outragious behavior and verbal abuse. We did reach out for a family counselor, but my son refused to go. I wanted to go back to marraige counseling, but stopped making and cancelling appointments when she became indifferant to the idea “It’s all about you, it’s all about you!”
Any ideas? I am toying with the idea of just calling the former marraige counselor and telling her the day and the time and then following up with the same for a family counselor. At this point what do i have to lose?

Wow. These are all very interesting situations.
My case does not seems that simple. I’ve been married 20 years and shortly after we got married I felt something was wrong. I worked and my wife was finishing up her undergraduate teaching degree in science. She graduated with high honors.
To further rewind the tape, I knew early on that my wife had issues with intimate relationships and that when we got closer her opening up to me attracted me to her even more. It was bliss and it felt like our needs were both being met.
The resent with me started some time between her student teaching and about three years after we had our first child. There was just no discussion about going to work or even seeking employment.
My Wife is not a yeller whatsoever. She holds it all in and has this infuriating way of stonewalling and ignoring me. I feel that if I press her on these important issues she will crumble like a china doll. So things just drift along and I got angrier by the day and at times verbally exasperated. You could call it abuse but it was truly like nailing a lemon marang pie to a tree. It’s incredible and when she eventually got upset, I felt terrible for even asking the question and guilty for losing my cool.
I actually said YEARS ago that our family felt like we had three children and one adult. I sought out therapy and soon peeled back some patterns which seemed obvious. My Wife grew up without a Dad, nor her Mother or Grandmother. I started to hear the nickel drop. It wasn’t all me, but i was still upset that nothing was going to change. Marriage counseling went just so far and my Wife simply chaulked the situation up as me being a moody crab and me needed medication to tamp that down.
Everyone loves my Wife. She is engaging, funny, caring, smart and loyal. She is also frugal.
She just shrinks, retreats and shuts down which makes me feel like I’m bearing down on a baby seal on pack ice. In other words, this ends the conversation and then the resentment builds since I am prevented from expressing my needs and fears. I’ve expressed myself lately in very concise, unemotional fashion and have been told that everything is about me. In other words I should just man up and get on with it. Discovering this web site has clued me into this behavior as code for really saying: continue taking care of me, and by extention, our children totally ignoring the fact that she bears as much of that responsibility as I do.
I just don’t see this changing and firmly beleive, as this article says that she is in need of years of psychotherapy.
I must confess that she did see a social worker last year, but because it was our former marraige counselor I was really put off and angry that my privacy was not being protected. A great therapist, but this was just unethical and I openly objected and said so.
In retrospect, that was a situation where I should have canned the beans and just let it play out. I probably was working against my own interests and regret even taking notice of that arrangement. My fear was being painted as the devil himself, whereas the counselor probably knew me better than that. A mistake.

How should a man deal with a Wife who has these characteristics, but does it in the image of the Easter Bunny?

Sounds like if a couple and tough it out long enough (and get lucky) you and hopefully mature into a relationship that feels comfortible.
I’ve been with the same person over 25 years. The first 15 were very up and very down.
We are in the middle now, but it may be because we are just too tired to keep climbing up and down that bloody hill.